BSV Forum - Writing - Beta

beta thoughts

Oct 09 2006 11:35 pm   #1slaymesoftly

Hmmm I thought I already did this, but must not have clicked the submit button. Sigh.  Okay, here are a couple of thoughts on betas:

1 - if you have listed yourself as a beta, please check your entry and be sure it isn't full of mistakes and typos!

2 - if you are looking for a beta, someone who either didn't know or didn't care enough to make their own description grammatically correct probably isn't your best choice. I'm just sayin'....

3 - if your beta is trying to teach you the reasons for changing things, listen!  There is no excuse for sending your beta chapter after chapter filled with mistakes that she has already shown you how to correct. You will just lose a good beta and your writing will suffer for it.

4 - if you already have a good beta - be very nice to her! LOL

I am not a minion of Evil...
I am upper management.
Oct 09 2006 11:42 pm   #2Always_jbj

A whopping great big YES to all of the above.

*huggles my beta*

Aim from the heart
Some will love and some will curse you, baby
You can go to war
But only if you have to 


Fanfic ~*~ Artwork ~*~ Live Journal
Oct 09 2006 11:45 pm   #3Diabola

Second that!

If you find any errors in your betalist entry, send me an email with the corrected text from the email account you used for that entry. That way I'll know one: which entry to edit, and two: that you're really you.

Btw, the same goes if you want to removed from the list.

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has limits." - Albert Einstein
Oct 10 2006 03:00 am   #4ZoeGrace

LMFAO @ #2

Oct 12 2006 12:43 am   #5GoldenBuffy

Yup, I agree with everything! And give you beta much huggles and snuggles and all in between.

If I might add, if your beta gives good advice you should think about taking it. Yes the story is your, but another set of eyes can add to it becoming better. (did that make sense?) 

And in the air the fireflies
Our only light in paradise
We'll show the world they were wrong
And teach them all to sing along
Oct 18 2006 07:31 pm   #6redwulf50

LMFAO,  if you don't trust your beta enough to listen to their ides, then why the hell are you using them.  Remember the beta is doing you a favor not the other way around.

Oct 19 2006 03:48 am   #7slaymesoftly

Well said, Wulfie! 

I am not a minion of Evil...
I am upper management.
Oct 19 2006 12:00 pm   #8Always_jbj

LOL... the pup's on a roll! That's twice in one day I find myself having to agree with him. OMG there must be an apocalypse coming!

Aim from the heart
Some will love and some will curse you, baby
You can go to war
But only if you have to 


Fanfic ~*~ Artwork ~*~ Live Journal
Oct 29 2006 01:01 pm   #9GoldenBuffy

ROFL, you'd be surprised at some who don't listen to their betas. Well so I've been told,lol.

And in the air the fireflies
Our only light in paradise
We'll show the world they were wrong
And teach them all to sing along
Nov 05 2006 05:42 am   #10Spikez_tart

Hi all - I had trouble finding a Beta - a lot of people didn't respond at all.  Maybe Dia could ask the Betas to update their list and anybody who doesn't can get taken off.  

Does anybody want to volunteer to beta a 50,000 fun Spuffy?

 

If we want her to be exactly she'll never be exactly I know the only really real Buffy is really Buffy and she's gone' who?
Nov 05 2006 06:16 am   #11Blood Faerie

Yes, I also scoured the list and got a lot of either "too busy for new betas" and mostly just no reply at all. I even heard some of them *cough* complaining about even being on the list at Writercon. It needs to be updated and sadly, we need some nice talented people to volunteer before we have no more beta volunteers on the beta list, heh.

Unfortunately, we had big vampires in the next room, and I didn't think they'd wait while we had hot monkey sex. ~Cerulean Sins :: (Anita to Jean-Claude)“Is there anything your bloodline does that doesn’t involve getting naked?" ~Danse Macabre :: I’m dating three men, living with two more, and having occasional sex with two others. That’s seven men. I’m like a pornographic Snow White. I think seven is plenty. ~Danse Macabre
Nov 05 2006 06:17 am   #12ZoeGrace

While I think people should find a beta that they can work with if they choose to use one, it's still the writer's story.  And if someone doesn't agree with their beta on a point, they have a right not to make the changes they disagree with.

People can bitch about people not listening to their betas all they want, but people should also remember whose story it is.

I have critiqued people before and told them what i think and sometimes they don't take my advice.  And that's fine.  It's their story.  And my opinion is just my opinion.  Looking at someone's story doesn't guarantee they are going to make all the changes you suggest.  And I don't think anyone should be lambasted for standing up for their story decisions if they really believe in them.


Nov 05 2006 07:28 am   #13Always_jbj

 I believe the point people are agreeing to is... 3 - if your beta is trying to teach you the reasons for changing things, listen!  There is no excuse for sending your beta chapter after chapter filled with mistakes that she has already shown you how to correct. You will just lose a good beta and your writing will suffer for it.

Nobody is talking about making changes to the 'story', simply that when your beta is correcting the same punctuation/grammar/spelling mistakes the writer should learn not to keep making the same mistakes over and over again. However, if your beta does make plot or continuity suggestions you should at the very least consider them and not just dismiss them out of hand. If you never take your beta's advice or learn from your mistakes you will quickly find yourself without a beta. But ultimately, you are correct... it is your story.

 

Aim from the heart
Some will love and some will curse you, baby
You can go to war
But only if you have to 


Fanfic ~*~ Artwork ~*~ Live Journal
Nov 05 2006 07:31 am   #14ZoeGrace

right, fair enough.  grammar, punctuation, spelling etc. should always be listened to, unless the beta is wrong.  there have been a couple of times i haven't changed a comma thing cause i thought the correction was wrong.

And yeah, the writer SHOULD learn from the mistakes.  Once they keep seeing the same thing over and over that should be a clue to stop making that mistake.

And I agree that you should consider plot changes and not just dismiss them.

Nov 06 2006 07:46 am   #15Always_jbj

LOL..well of course you shouldn't make the change if it is wrong... beta's are, afterall, human too...and just as capable of making mistakes as anyone else. If, however, you have a competent and knowledgable beta the chance of mistakes being made is considerably lessened.

*Is grateful everyday for my wonderful, wonderful betas...who are slowly but surely beating my bad habits out of me* lol

Aim from the heart
Some will love and some will curse you, baby
You can go to war
But only if you have to 


Fanfic ~*~ Artwork ~*~ Live Journal
Nov 06 2006 08:12 am   #16ZoeGrace

haha did you mean to mispell "habits" ;)

Nov 06 2006 08:18 am   #17Always_jbj

*giggles* Nup... just bloody tired today.

Off to fix...thanks.

Aim from the heart
Some will love and some will curse you, baby
You can go to war
But only if you have to 


Fanfic ~*~ Artwork ~*~ Live Journal
Nov 06 2006 09:35 am   #18ZoeGrace

hahaha i thought it was on purpose and a joke lol.

Nov 16 2006 12:39 am   #19Jackofspikes

 

Okay, now this may be completely off topic, but a little idea has been nagging at me for months. Quite aside from a beta as we know them, has anyone considered the advantages of listing available cleaners?

For those of you that don't know what a cleaner is - it is a person that will read your work over for obvious mistakes. All those little things that for any myriad of reasons we can miss; typo's, spelling mistakes that word has missed or the wrong word has been used, missing words. They also look at plot points. For example they make sure that something you wrote in chapter one is not refuted in chapter twenty-six.

None of us are perfect. We all miss little mistakes. The inclusion of a cleaner before the chapter is sent to a beta would help avoid the small things and allow the beta to do what they do best. Correct grammatical errors and make suggestions for plot improvement.

Now I know we should be 'cleaning' our own work before it goes to our betas, but a second set of eyes could not be thought of as a bad thing.

There are many people out there, myself included, who do not have the skills to be a beta - but that doesn't mean we wouldn't jump at the chance to help in any small way that we can. Supporting each other is as much a part of fan fiction writing as the writing itself.

If a list of cleaners was made available in much the same way as the list of betas is available it, in my opinion, could prove to be a valuable resource to all of our writers.

Jack

Nov 16 2006 01:11 am   #20Diabola

I think we've just called the "cleaners" "betas" up until now. LOL There are some people on the beta list who only do plot, or style or whatever.

But you gave me an idea there, how about I split the beta-list into categories accoring to what they are willing to help with? You could choose whether you want help with your plot, your punctuation or everything without having to read through the whole list....

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has limits." - Albert Einstein
Nov 16 2006 01:18 am   #21Jackofspikes

Works for me :D

Nov 16 2006 01:42 am   #22Blood Faerie

Would it also be possible to make it able to order it to what rating they will beta, too? I usually have to sift through for those that will beta NC-17 and such :)

Unfortunately, we had big vampires in the next room, and I didn't think they'd wait while we had hot monkey sex. ~Cerulean Sins :: (Anita to Jean-Claude)“Is there anything your bloodline does that doesn’t involve getting naked?" ~Danse Macabre :: I’m dating three men, living with two more, and having occasional sex with two others. That’s seven men. I’m like a pornographic Snow White. I think seven is plenty. ~Danse Macabre
Nov 16 2006 01:52 am   #23Diabola

Sure, I can add sub-categories. Good idea.

"The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has limits." - Albert Einstein

 Closed