Probably not the place for this but I's been weighing on my mind. Spike was sired in 1880, chipped in Novenber of 1999 ("The Initiative"). That is 125 years as a functioning vampire. Take that times 365 (days in a year) to get 45,625 victims a day based on one a day. Now I imagine there were more and don't deny his reveling in the evil but still that is not 300,000 +.

If we are Spuffy fans we have decided to look beyond his years of killing. The issue is Buffy and her fully souled behavior and choices. I think what upset so many of us (yet is so in character) is how her character flaws have allowed her to put one she claims to love in danger when he is most vulnerable. She was so sure her Slayer speed and strength could keep Spike safe that she didn't give any further thought to safeguarding Spike with her plan. Had she arranged for Angel or Anya to be hidden in her closet, for example (since Xander would not expect either of those two to be there for movie night), it would have shown some concern that Spike be protected. Xander had a gun that he had already used and all the Slayer speed in the world can't outrun a bullet. Xander could also stake Spike before Buffy could burst in had Xander not used magic.

No one is really saying Buffy is evil, just thoughtless and careless. Yes she DOES need to earn Spike's trust again. If you love someone you take their word for things and you put their safety first...she did neither.

Okay....sorry for hijacking the reviews for this but it's been gnawing at me. No, Spike is no saint ("wouldn't be half as much fun"), but neither is Buffy. That is the beauty of the couple....they fit perfectly together in all their aspects.

Kathleen

A very interesting chapter. I didn't see the bullet train special coming, though. It makes sense completely in hindsight. I was waiting for angel to attack, as I doubted he would have stood with the gang and spike, rather he'd just slip around and kill Xander himself.

Anyone who believes that the maddness will begin and end with a gunshot is crazy, though. Buffy has been making many mistakes, from hurting Spike, to hurting Dawn (wall throw), to being a general control freak (Again, the Scoobies are like Xander's dad)...that if she thinks she can get up from this dinner without paying the check...she is in for a shock.

I am waiting for the fallout where Spike walks off, the Buffy sob fest, and the drag out scream match between Dawn and Buffy.

Spike remembers now, but what will happen to him? Poor guy, thinking that Buffy cares nothing for him when she's just as caught in it as he is. Can't wait to see what you do next.

Wow. You are going some interesting places with this one. And there's Spike, still thinking about Buffy even while she hurts him again.

...well I certainly didn't see that coming. Brilliant plot!

Spike has such a generous heart, even after buffy tramples all over it he can still sacrifice himself for her (and Dawn ofcourse)

The chapter was so believable (for lack of a better word) the characters' reactions were true to how you have written them. It was truly heartwrenching to read the choice they had to make...although the should have realised sooner the would have to decide what to do with Xander. Everything is still showing that Buffy really didn't think her plan through, she only thought as far as getting the proof. Denial was obviously still rearing it's ugly head.

I can't wait for the next chapter, I hope Spike isn't too hurt. I'm really curious about everybody's reactions though, I can't imagine Angel will be pleased.

Three cheers for Zoe for those points.

Though, I am on the side of a spuffy ending. Only...one that is well drawn out, with Buffy soul searching, working to becoming a better person, and months (if not years) after this event finally proving herself to Spike.


On another note, strange to see that I was right on my prediction that someone innocent would die because Buffy would fail to do what needed to be done, and instead would dance around the subject.

The blood of the Harris family is on her hands, as it is on Anya's and Giles. Their failure to look beyond their double standard (again, if Spike were human and Xander a vamp...things would have been completely different) caused the deaths of two people.

That was awesome DOS, and I didn't expect Spike to step in and save Xander. Cool.

You led this chapter to a very logical ending point. Well done.

You're so good and the evil cliffhanger not so good!

Maybe this isn't the place to say this, but in reply to the last reviewer...I like Buffy just fine. I just don't like the way she is behaving in THIS story.

And yeah, Spike liked being a vampire, honestly he should. Just like people shouldn't feel guilty about eating cheeseburgers. I'm not saying according to human standards that spike wasn't evil. But Buffy chose to get involved with a vampire. That should make him her first priority.

Well I know this will probably not be popular, but I have to say it anyway. I like Spike as much as anyone, but you have to look at reality.Vampires kill people to live. If he killed only one person a day to survive, in the time he's lived that works out to be over three hundred thousand people, and Spike reveled in being a vampire, so I'm sure it added up to a lot more than that. He thought of people as "happy meals with legs" and has also called people as nothing more than "cattle" It's only been since he got his chip and started having feelings for Buffy that his feelings for humanity have begun to change. ...Buffy on the other hand has been a slayer for a few short years but was called when she was a mere child of what, fifteen? Told that essentially her life was no longer her own. She could no longer choose her own destiny. All choices would from now on be made by the Watchers Council or The Powers That Be or by some obscure prophecy.She would never grow old and would in all probability have her life taken by being eaten or worse by something demonic in origin. How would an adult react, never mind a 15 year old child.She's lost her Mum, her life , her ability to decide her future and her free will. Poor thing. to compare her to Spike or to any vampire that's lived as long is ridiculous. She's a warrior of light for the Power's for the good of the people and never thanked for all her sacrifices.She's judged so harshly. How would any of us feel if our loved ones were slaughtered for food and for sport because it was fun? A good time. To be tortured and maimed just for the thrill of it, by a demon? Remember Spike saying he love being a vampire? The stories he'd tell Dawn about killing children, like the little one hiding in the coal bin? If the mass audience for this genre can forgive him so easily for all he's done wrong , then how can they tear Buffy apart so badly? I really like Buffy. She's honourable and has taken a crappy set of circumstances and tried to deal with it as best she could. She doesn't want Spike to be tortured. She doesn't want any sentient creature to be tortured and remember it was Buffy who wouldn't kill Spike when he became helpless as per show canon. Give her a break. I mean , why read Spuffy in the first place if you hate Buffy?

ok its not that I think willow should torture him, and she probably shouldn't be the one to do it, but Xander has to die. To let him live after THIS. Well no human would be allowed to live after this. It's called the death penalty.

But it can't be used in this case because a human justice system can't defend a vampire. The death penalty exists to protect people from future crimes by said dangerous individual and also because sometimes people are too screwed up to ever get better and putting them down is a mercy.

I'm also pretty appalled by Buffy's reaction and I don't really think she deserves spike in this fic. And I would be kind of disappointed now if they ended up together after this betrayal. She's betrayed him time after time here. First by setting him up to "prove" it's Xander, and now by defending Xander's life. I hope to God they don't end up together in this fic. Spike deserves so much better and no amount of groveling on her part changes that.

This is maybe just me, but in some sense Buffy has accepted and sees Spike as her mate. When your mate has been hurt you don't defend their attacker or try to save the attacker's life. To me, this makes Buffy not a hero, but an immoral monster. Sure, mete out justice swiftly and quickly, make it justice, not vengeance, but Xander has to die here. Hell, let Spike do it or Angel, so no human hands are muddied but it has to be done. He has to die.

If he doesn't and if Buffy isn't called to task for the betrayal of trying to save him after what he did to Spike, then I can't consider it a satisfactory ending. I know it's your story and you have to write it the way you have to write it, but that's the way I feel about it.

To write a story this dramatic with the torture and torment, there really is only one way this can end with Xander. It's too late to save him, after building the story in this way.

JMO

Ahhh!! Another cliffy!! :'( AWESOME last two chaps!! Can't wait for what's next.

I'm glad Dawn couldn't do it. Poor kid!!

Good chapter. I think Spike had to be the one to stop the violence because really it is about him. I have read some of the reviews and I don't really understand the hatred some of the reviewers have for Buffy. She does not always make the right decisions and she is definitely not nice to Spike but she tries to do the right thing. As for Buffy being the Judge, Jury and Executioner that is her job. She is a vampire slayer not defense counsel. I don't think that Buffy and Spike should immediately get back together but people forgive those they love pretty quickly every day I don't know why this relationship should be any different.

Thanks for the update - looking forward to the next fix.

All I can say again is that Spike risks it all for some ungrateful people. I was with Dawn. Xander does deserve to pay but I wouldn't want that on her conscious for the rest of her life. I don't know if that is something she could ever truly live with. I am so biting my nails because I can't wait to find out what happens next.

OMG! I can't believe Spike took the blow for Xander. I understand his wanting to make sure everyone stayed safe, but this is too much. I was surprised at how much Dawn was drawn into the lust for vengance, but I was glad she was able to back off before something even worse happened. It's telling that Buffy could see that even though she hadn't meant to chose Xander over Spike her actions seemed that way to him. Given their history it is easy to see why he would assume that his pain was less important to her than her friends, but I hope they can talk and she can explain her actions.

Well, I actually expected Spike to save Xander. Once crazyWillow appeared, he HAD to be the one to do it. Since his heart is already stopped, it shouldn't make a HUGE amount of difference in the state of his unlife, although it'll probably hurt to be hit with the magic.
I liked Buffy trying to stop Willow because of Dawn.

A comment to Buffy about the Willow having the right to judge:

But youhave the right to be judge,jury and executionor for every demon and vampire you find? Willow has killed 1 person, who did something wrong in his culture, and was going to kill another.

Buffy has killed...what...thousands...of vampires for doing what they do naturally.

Buffy is a poacher. A big game hunter. She is no worse then the great white hunters killing lions because they don't like it when the lions kill other creatures.


Now then, with all this building up, with Buffy's shit pile growing bigger, I am getting the bad feeling that we are in for a letdown. That you have made her mistkaes so many...that when you do go to settle it, the solution will seem forced. Its kinda how I felt in Blood Bond. You have them dance around a subject for afew chapters, but then they basically settle it in two. I know, I know, there were still hints of problems. But that story set up a long drawn out angst fest, and instead delievered a quicky solution, in my eyes. My opinion only.

I just hope you take the time in this story to let buffy suffer. That you don't bow to demands of making it short, so everyone can ee the Spuffy.

That said, I also hope you do not have Spike become moopy and...well...a big wuss. My biggest complaint in all your stories, as you know all too well, is that you make Spike waaaaaayyy to weak at times. So far, in this story, hardly at all (A good excuse for him to be like ascared kitten in this one).

But again, bad feeling that Spike is just going to walk away, and pout in his crypt,instead of doing what he needs to do: Scream at them all, yell, throw a fit, tell them all off then flip the bird and storm off.

I really hope I am wrong, and he does that.

Please don't make us wait to long to find ot what happens next. Please?

Oh no! You certainly have a way with words! You have painted us an amazing picture, and I hope you keep painting it....

GO SPIKE!!!!! Great Chapter! Man! I still dont know what i hope to happen! I am just going to have to wait! THank yoU!

Oh yes, so typical Spike...I'd say he's returned to himself. He'd never let Willow do something that would eventually lead to Buffy and Dawn hurting or dead. I'd bet the seed of decision happened when he saw Dawn's distress.

Powerful chapter...too bad Xander is the only one to still not get it.

Kathleen

Small wonder Spike wants to sacrifice himself! He's too noble for his own good.

wow! that was a chapter that's worth waiting... Good job! But Spike saving Xander, come on! I think he should be the one who kills him not Willow so nobody is destroyed rigth? I know wishful thinking..oh and update soon please!

I have to disagree with Spike, in that I don't think this time Willow *would* kill them all accidentally after this. Herself, feasibly, but I think after the last time, that she would just go off alone and do it, instead of taking it out on all the others. She's come that far, in how you've written her. So, brave, stupid vampire......you might fry for this, Spike.

I would have reviewed sooner, but I had a nosy boyfriend hanging over my shoulder, and it was really bugging me! Looking forward to the next chapter.

Give us more!!!You can`t just stop like that!!I really hope Buffy suffers in some way.She has repeatedly let Spike down,even though I realise were she was coming from,wanting solid evidence against Xander,but come on.Spike is supposed to be her great love,ain`t feeling that at this point.

I didn`t care much for Willow making Dawn come up with a plan.And I don`t think that Buffy could say "I told you so"concerning the breakdown with Dawn.At least Dawn realise what a monster Xander has become,and I don`t think big sis has figured that one out...not even at this point.

Okay...lot of frustration her.This story brings out such emotions and it`s not fair to keep us hanging like this:( Can``t wait for an update!!!!:D Keep on the excellent job!!

Xander's screwed up reasoning for torturing Spike fits with canon. He went after Spike after he slept with Anya even though he left her at the altar and then he was pissed about Buffy sleeping with Spike even though she was never his girlfriend.

Dammit Spike. Fudge Xander, lol. But then Willow would go all crazy Willow, and Sunnydale would look like it did at the end of Chosen or worse. I hope Spike doesn't dust because of this. Great update.

Great chapter.
Now I have to wait to see what's gonna happen next!

Damn girl, you're really doing a number on us. Having Spike chose the love of his girls over his own pain. Just rip my heart out why don't ya. Fantastic job!!! Having Dawn share in the punishment, when we know it will effct her eventually. Probably one of the best chapters of the story, thanks DOS.

Can one die from suspense? Can that be legally cited on a death certificate?

Please, update soon, or I'll hold you personally responsible...

...lol, really great chapter, I obviously can't wait for more.

very good read, thank you. damned evil place to stop, thank you.

A truly great chapter -- such a complex of emotions swirling around.
But, but, but, I've never complained about your cliffies, but *that* was an EEEEeeevil place to stop. Naughty DoS. No tea and biscuits for you. :)

Wooooow.....I thought that SPike might be the one to stop Willow from killing Xander, just because he's always been a practical vamp, and would see what it would to to everyone. Which is not to say that he doesn't need to DIE....a lot!.....but someone else could do the deed. Like some big dude in prison named Sue, with jailhouse swastika tattoos and a fondness for brunettes.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!

That was the most horrible place that you could have stopped. I suppose that's why you stopped there :P

Again, people who wouldn't raise a hand to save themselves many times make the very bravest heroes. I'm looking forward to seeing how this all turns out. It's been a long, bumpy ride--and I have a feeling it just might get bumpier.

Is Spike your favorite punching bag?

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You're EVIL!!! EEEEVIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh my god! Holy crap!

That was an awesome chapter, DoS! I am seriously wigging right now!

I love it!! More soon please???