I would like to read a fic where Spike lost his soul in the Hellmouth. It would be cool if he did not realize his lack of soul for a while. Or he might know, and be afraid to face Buffy without it. Anyone read such a fic?

I think I read a one shot like that in one of Maryperk's 'Scenes without a Story' (which is on her site), but I;m not a hundred percent sure.

There are quite a few fics like that, I believe. Anaross's amazing My Life Closed Twice is one excellent one. I have at least one short fic, possibly more, I can't remember just now. The one I can remember is Dear John (http://spuffystuff.org/dearjohn.htm) if you can't find it on here.  Always Wait for You has soulless future Spike, although he does not lose the soul in the Hellmouth.  I think Anaross may have more than one in which Spike loses his soul in the Hellmouth, but I can't think of the titles just now.

That "Always Wait For You" is a wonderful story - try that if you have not read it.  Anaross, another terrific writer.

Actually that scene is in the Buffy and Then 'story' as a response to something kargrif wrote.

Hi! Thanks a lot for wonderfully fast answearing and good recommendations:) I had allready read and cried for the "Always wait for you", but thanks for the remainder:) I loved Dear John, and My Life Closed Twice was really, really amazing, both for its wonderful plot and charachetizations, and for giving an English Poetry crash course:)

Thanks, Sunshine. I'm glad you liked them. Yes, one of the coolest things about My Life Closed Twice (other than the wonderful Spuffy) is how much you learn about poetry from it.  It's worth reading just for that, almost. :)

I just have to add this, because it's an amazing story with great ideas and twists and emotions. It reached thirty chapters with a lot of info before it stopped, and it will probably always remain a WIP, but what is there is great, and could help look at a bunch of aspects of what happened in the series. It starts off a little tangled as it sets the scene after the battle but that smooths out quickly. Spike did lose his soul in the Hellmouth, but so much has happened to his character that no one realized it had gone until after the story's start after NFA.

It's called As the Romans Do by Helga Von Nutwimple. http://www.fanfiction.net/s/1945667/1/As_The_Romans_Do  I strongly recomend a look.

P.S, Sunshine, have you ever read the novel Sunshine by Robin McKinley? It's a lot of fun, and very different from most books with vampires and a unique perspective from the main character, named Sunshine.

Word of warning As the Romans do is a long term WIP. It's a good read but it's injlikely it'll be updated soon.

P.S, Sunshine, have you ever read the novel Sunshine by Robin McKinley? It's a lot of fun, and very different from most books with vampires and a unique perspective from the main character, named Sunshine.


The novel Sunshine is one of my favorites, I wish R.M. would write a sequel, there is so much room for more.

Pity that "As the Romans Do" will not be completed - I both understand and don't understand how writers can abandoned their works after so much effort.  I can see tossing out paintings, short works and even a medium since piece, but something with 30 chapters already completed - I just don't get it.  And what I really don't get is a writer leaving a work available for reading online after they have made the determination to quick work on the piece.  Even if they would post an outline of what they had planned would help, but leaving works for people to begin reading and then simply not finishing them - I may be harsh, but I just don't understand that.  If an author has lost all inspiration for the work, I think they should take them offline - 

What about some of the other readers - do you read permanent WIP stories?  Does it bother you to read a story, there are so many outstanding works that have been left as WIP's - would you rather have an outstanding story to read, even if it is not completed?

Collateral Damage by cindergal has a Spike who loses his soul in Chosen.

http://www.livejournal.com/tools/memories.bml?user=cindergal&keyword=Collateral+Damage&filter=all

Ariane has a fic at the Crypt about losing his sould and becoming human called "If not today"

nmcil: "I both understand and don't understand how writers can abandoned their works after so much effort.  I can see tossing out paintings, short works and even a medium since piece, but something with 30 chapters already completed - I just don't get it."

Other than the fact that RL tends to walk up and bite people in the face every now and then, I think there is psychological stuff that creeps in after awhile too.  Maybe when the thing you are writing is purely a labor of love, it contains all of the pitfalls and heartburns and spiraling misery and madness of love as well.  Thin line between love and hate, and all that rot.

It can be also be daunting if you've written and published so much in a serial format, but when you go back to reread it you discover that you're unhappy with much of what you've written.  That can be a real big slap in the face, even worse than the feeling that nobody is interested in what you've been beating yourself silly to write over a period of a couple of years.

nmcil:  "And what I really don't get is a writer leaving a work available for reading online after they have made the determination to quit work on the piece.  Even if they would post an outline of what they had planned would help, but leaving works for people to begin reading and then simply not finishing them - I made be harsh, but I just don't understand that.  If an author has lost all inspiration for the work, I think they should take them offline"

I think the "determination to quit work" is the tricky part.  It's not always that simple.   I think it's sort of like when you breakup with someone but they haven't really left you entirely, and there's always a little candle you keep lit up in your chest somewhere, wondering if you might get back together some day. 

(Okay, I went and made another lame love analogy there, but to be fair I was about to make a reference to an episode of the "A-Team" instead.  Lesser of two evils.) 

It's true.....an author can mean to get back to it, want to, and not want to finally give up. Because it does feel like giving up to say "I can't finish". Eventually, they haven't thought about that story in a long time and might have even forgotten they had it somewhere.

Life is like that.

I asked an author just today if her WIP had an ending she knew. She wants to finish it, just hasn't had the time. It's been quite a while, so maybe she'll never have the time, but she's not ready to cut the cord, yet.

If an author has lost all inspiration for the work, I think they should take them offline

I don't agree with this. People are free not to read permanent WIPs, but there are some amazing stories that only exist in WIP form, and I would hate it if the author removed them from the web.

I know that I am probably way out of line - but even if a writer would keep working on a piece from the perspective of developing your skills - force yourself to try and complete the work, try to find the answers to the questions that are holding up progress, try to find solutions for the needs of the story.  And as far as earlier works - that is just what they are earlier works, the future work is what, IMO, should be the concern -
you can always go back to attend to small sections of an earlier piece.  A writer can also simply make a statement about this being some of the first attempts.  It is understood by readers that as you work your work will get better and better. 

Real Life problems, that's an altogether different issue - shit happens, and it happens all the time.  Whn really bad crap comes in, so many things just fall into insignificance.  To be  a  writer  you have to write.  I am in awe of people who have the gift for writing - the creativity that a writer must bring into any work is an amazing thing.  Even the worst muck requires so much imagination - people who have that creative gift should not let it go easily.  If family and time becomes a big issue, write small works or go back a make an earlier work better.

Sorry for the rant - and I want to say again to all the fine writers here and everywhere in the Buffyverse community - THANKS FOR THE WORK.

"I don't agree with this. People are free not to read permanent WIPs, but there are some amazing stories that only exist in WIP form, and I would hate it if the author removed them from the web."

This is fine, but the writers should clearly state that the work will more than likely not be completed in the description and information section of posted works.

Nmcil, I don't post here (and under another pen name) and not because I don't want to.  I just don't take my writing as seriously as some do here.  I do it for fun...If I make a mistake (which I try my hardest not to) then I just shrug.  So I basically just smiled and moved on and posted elsewhere.  At first I was 'one of those' who was bitter, but it makes sense, and sometimes not.  You have to look at it logically, and I did.  I can still read here.

If I come across reading something WIP...I might pass it over, but there are times that I have read an amazing description, and have read them.

My point is: I agree with Lostboy and Goldenusagi.  I read back mine and I hate it too.  I have been going back over mine, but there are other factors...

Some have success finding beta's and others don't.  Some get their work back in time...and others might get it back weeks later.  Then comes the question of real life...and their muses.  You can't control that.  Sure the story is in your head...but the words are hard to come by.  You don't want to put crap down or something that is less than stellar to the writer.  See we may have the readers review, but I believe; we, the writers, are our own worst critics.

Some writers come in and are rearing to go...and then life happens that they have no control over.  Some that do lose interest--those I do believe should speak out and say something, but over all?  No.  We can't control how this goes...I am still around and haven't updated in months.  Not because I don't want to...just the muse took a stroll?  Even with going back and revising...it's a chore, and being a single parent and working long hours--it takes a lot out of you.

I love I believe Irishrose's story...It's on here and it's not done.  Am I upset it's not finished...somewhat, but I loved it!  It opens your own imagination to what could be the end...should that writer never come back.  Then there is GoldenBuffy's It happened one Night...and also my fave redwulf's stories (yes all of them!)...and Bloodshedbaby's stories too...Some are still around, but they tend to either veer off or evolve...

To take those stories down is a horrible idea!  I think having them there is great!  Now, if what you are looking for...if they are having difficult they can state it....then I'm all for that.  I think on EF they do that to one story by Witchiepoo?  I might be mistaken.  But, I agree giving us some sort of walk into their imagination...is worth it whether it is finished or not.  Some have come back after two years...so I have some hope some will come back...and if not I'm glad they graced this fandom...just my opinion.  :)

I remember a story I read (all at one time) a million years ago that I somehow lost track of. I mentioned it somewhere, someone knew the title and where I should look, I found it and reread it a year or so ago.  It was as lovely as I remembered, but it still ended in the same place. It is a permanent wip, apparently.  But that didn't detract at all from how enjoyable it was up to that point. The gradual development of Buffy and Spike's new relationship, and his adjustment to his new status was much more important than how it was going to end. Perhaps if the relationship part hadn't been resolved, I would have objected more, but as it is, I would have been very sad if it had been taken down because the author wasn't going to finish it. The relationships were more important than knowing if they got the baddies.

If it's really a good story, well-told and well-written, it can be enjoyable even if the reader doesn't know how it finally comes out. IMHO, anyway.  And, since all fan fic writers are doing it for love of the fandom and/or love of writing and telling stories, they are under no obligation to meet anyone else's expectations as to what they do with their stories.  A writer who becomes known for never finishing wip will probably lose his/her audience eventually as word gets around to that effect; but a story here or there that gets sidetracked or abandoned for whatever reason is hardly the end of the world. No one is being paid; no contracts are being violated (except perhaps the unspoken contract between ff author and reader that there will be a finished product); and there is no guarantee when someone begins posting something serially that it will not be abandoned at some time. 

I know a lot of people who do not read any wip. Not necessarily because they don't trust the authors, but because they prefer to know a story is complete and that they can read the whole thing at one time.  That would be my suggestion for readers who object to being burned by a permanent wip - just don't read anything until it is marked "complete" on an archives' list of fics.

"It can be also be daunting if you've written and published so much in a serial format, but when you go back to reread it you discover that you're unhappy with much of what you've written.  That can be a real big slap in the face, even worse than the feeling that nobody is interested in what you've been beating yourself silly to write over a period of a couple of years"

Huge problem for sure - but that is just part of the creative process - the good thing is that it generally indicates growth of skill and understanding and the desire to make your work better.  The lack of readers, or for visual artist viewers, that too is something that can break down the creative person.  It breaks my heart to see how little my work is looked at - I spend days on my film project and I am lucky if 30 or 40  people in total view it. Ultimately it comes down to how much love and pleasure I get from creating them, but it is hard to put so much of your  heart and all the effort into a work and have so few people make a connection with it.  

Again, I really don't mean to be offensive to the writers, I Love reading the FF works and I do appreciate all the works that are posted online.    
 

nmcil - there are a lot of Live Journal art communities you could join. And some art/fic communities. Nekid_Spike is one, all the Spuffy communities (Seasonal Spuffy, Late Season Love, etc) use both art and fic. Many communities have periodic "art for fic" or "fic for art" challenges.  The more of those you belong to and submit work for, the more people who will see your work.

Just to answear "186d"; No, I have not read "Sunshine", but I will look into it, thanks:) The reason for my nick is just such a lame thing as it being  the direct English translation of my own name (I`m Norwegian).

Personally, I get sad when I read a fic that is not to be finished, but I still read them. My reason for liking fanfic is more about "the road as a goal for itself" (sorry about my English here..) As long as the story is well written, how it ends is not so important. Most of the time the end is rather noninteresting, it is how they get there that I like to read. So as long as the story has progressed beyond the most interesting parts of the story, I am often OK with it being WIP, and I perfectly understands that writers loose interest. But I really, really appreciate those who use their time to finnish long, well written stories. Thanks!